tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28988815.post9200386090528996359..comments2023-08-15T06:44:05.705-05:00Comments on Pure Church: Why I Am a Congregationalist, 2FellowElderhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08590139703839397873noreply@blogger.comBlogger5125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28988815.post-26480358803775843862008-11-02T22:03:00.000-05:002008-11-02T22:03:00.000-05:00Thabiti,Thanks for taking the time to respond so g...Thabiti,<BR/><BR/>Thanks for taking the time to respond so graciously and thoughtfully. Your answer was helpful. You raise things I hadn't thought of before. I appreciate it!<BR/><BR/>-JeffAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28988815.post-61742505814175758892008-11-01T09:41:00.000-05:002008-11-01T09:41:00.000-05:00Hi Jeff,Thanks for the great question. You (and o...Hi Jeff,<BR/><BR/>Thanks for the great question. You (and others) don't have to be shy about asking a question or worry about being judged as having an agenda on the sly. We all have an agenda, and that is to know, love, enjoy, and serve our Savior more today than we did yesterday! So, anything that helps us understand His word better and take it into our hearts as precious is a good agenda, even when there is some differing views. Your question is most welcome.<BR/><BR/>What I think the Scripture models is that the congregation under the Lordship of Christ and His word is the authoritative body to appeal to. So, the final appeal is made by and made to the body as a whole. <BR/><BR/>In the case of removing a pastor, it probably looks like a series of hopefully prayerful discussions and biblical study of the key issues, and a congregational decision/vote. This is difficult because, honestly, if we had to generalize, the levels of theological and biblical literacy in churches is quite low. So, there is a major weakness in the congregational system if the congregation isn't well taught, or the congregation is largely unregenerate, or if the congregation seems to be abandoning the truth (as was the case in Galatia). Those are real dangers. <BR/><BR/>But it still leaves us with the congregation either taking a deliberate vote/action or individuals "voting with their feet" in the case you mention. One way or the other, the congregation will act. The very sad reality is that when a man teaches falsely in the pulpit the "strong Christians" are the ones who often abandon "weaker Christians" by leaving the church to the errant teacher. We tend to say, "I love the word and the gospel; it's not being taught here any more; so, I'm going to leave and find a place where it is." But the presumption of Galatians and Jude, for example, works in the opposite direction. It seems to me the correct response is for the body to remember what it received, contend for it, and remove those who blemish the love feast. There is an implicit congregationalism at work in those cases where the body acts as the final authority.<BR/><BR/>Hope that helps. And thank you again for taking the time to drop the question.<BR/><BR/>T-FellowElderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08590139703839397873noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28988815.post-13079802625779172042008-11-01T01:01:00.000-05:002008-11-01T01:01:00.000-05:00Thabiti,I don't know where I stand on this issue, ...Thabiti,<BR/><BR/>I don't know where I stand on this issue, but I have a question. If there is no authoritative body to appeal to, how would a church go about removing a pastor who is teaching false doctrine? How does something like that play our practically? No ulterior motives in my question, I'm just curious to know!Jeff Lockehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07683360460942070413noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28988815.post-69752764384598575712008-10-31T21:18:00.000-05:002008-10-31T21:18:00.000-05:00Wonderful post Thabiti. Thank you and amen! :-)...Wonderful post Thabiti. Thank you and amen! :-)doughttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18402848051284980448noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28988815.post-23953941665334848032008-10-31T13:29:00.000-05:002008-10-31T13:29:00.000-05:00Thanks for these posts. While not persuaded, you m...Thanks for these posts. While not persuaded, you make a strong case. But I wholeheartedly agree that this is not a gospel issue, not a fundamental issue, and that unless leaders and laypeople prayerfully seek "the wisdom that comes from above" both congregational and elder-led forms of polity will break down.<BR/><BR/>BTW I made a strong plug for <EM>What is a Healthy Church Member?</EM> at our last Session meeting. I'm hoping we'll use it in one of our Sunday School classes and/or new member classes. Grace and peace.Stephen Leyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02498952171697022917noreply@blogger.com