tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28988815.post6293174429677596397..comments2023-08-15T06:44:05.705-05:00Comments on Pure Church: Theologically-Driven PreachingFellowElderhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08590139703839397873noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28988815.post-41366088112800117892007-04-23T09:21:00.000-05:002007-04-23T09:21:00.000-05:00Jim,I'll try to find time to take a look at your b...Jim,<BR/>I'll try to find time to take a look at your blod. <BR/><BR/>In the meantime, I think what I'd is that I'm not advocating "forced membership." I'm not sure what you mean by that term. <BR/><BR/>It seems to me that some notion of identifiable membership (commitment to a local body of believers) is assumed or implicit in most of the NT's teaching on the local church. For example, when Paul writes to the church of Corinth instructing them to put the man in adultery "out of your fellowship," (1 Cor. 5:1-8) it assumes some identifiable group to which he belongs. It also assumes that group has some standards for belonging. In other words, membership is there implicit. ! Tim. 3 and Titus 1 specify qualifications for leadership in the church. Again, this presumes that their is some followers to lead. That's just a couple of examples.<BR/><BR/>Now, I'm not suggesting that there is some chapter or book of the Bible dedicated to membership that details how it is to be done, etc. There is liberty for each church's practice. But I do think the evidence, though implicit, suggests that some form of membership was normative in the NT context and should be normative in our day. <BR/><BR/>Moreover, while a person certainly can find and does find meaningful membership in some other forms (small groups, friendships, etc.), and while I would encourage those other forms, those forms are not to take the place of belonging to and contributing to the whole/entire church.<BR/><BR/>I take it from Eph. 4 and other places that it is God's intent that the local church, with officers dedicated to the task, that is to be the main location, instrument, and context for the discipling and maturing of believers into Christlikeness. And that requires something far more concrete in terms of membership and belonging and commitment than most churches practice today.<BR/><BR/>I hope that helps,<BR/>ThabitiFellowElderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08590139703839397873noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28988815.post-9598991054965537692007-04-22T21:42:00.000-05:002007-04-22T21:42:00.000-05:00Good evening Thabiti,Being new to this whole blog ...Good evening Thabiti,<BR/>Being new to this whole blog thing I’, hoping you see this post!<BR/><BR/>You replied to me post:<BR/>Truthkeeper,<BR/>This is why the emphasis on a healthy understanding of membership is so important, especially for the new/young convert. It's in the context of such covenant commitments that they'll get the love, care, instruction, fellowship, and oversight necessary to growth in Christ.<BR/><BR/>Thabiti<BR/><BR/>My question once again is why the forced membership?? I don’t see a lot of membership talk in the NT. It almost seems as if your saying without membership in your group there can’t be any of the things you mentioned above. I thought that when someone came to accept Jesus as savior they were at that moment in covenant relationship with the rest of the body. Are you saying that someone can’t be saved and grow to maturity outside of your group?? I’m not liking what the emerging movement has become but some of this is what drove them out the doors of the organized church. I’m not wanting to drag this out but if you have time you can visit my blog to get an idea of where I’ve been and what drives my thinking on all of this.<BR/>Looking forward from hearing from you!!<BR/><BR/>In Christ,<BR/>Jim Kahlertruthkeeperhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04026968262796466582noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28988815.post-11113830107656168782007-04-20T20:54:00.000-05:002007-04-20T20:54:00.000-05:00The problems can be somewhat mitigated if a church...The problems can be somewhat mitigated if a church is taught the Biblical principles of discipline before there is a crisis. Likewise, when people ask to be received into fellowship, there needs to be a clear understanding that this is a church that practices discipline on those (hopefully rare) occasions that warrant it.Shawn Abigailhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09810173103807948064noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28988815.post-56937314888589293192007-04-20T18:55:00.000-05:002007-04-20T18:55:00.000-05:00Shawn,Actually, my experience is just the opposite...Shawn,<BR/>Actually, my experience is just the opposite with church discipline. I think a man and the leadership of a church needs to be prepared to see people leave who don't want the loving care of discipline when necessary, and a church needs to be careful in the exercise of discipline by being sure it's (1) warranted and (2) there is a context where membership and fellowship are meaningful. But when that's in place, usually the people of God are humbled, thankful, and stirred to further love and good deeds when discipline is conducted.<BR/><BR/>Truthkeeper,<BR/>This is why the emphasis on a healthy understanding of membership is so important, especially for the new/young convert. It's in the context of such covenant commitments that they'll get the love, care, instruction, fellowship, and oversight necessary to growth in Christ.<BR/><BR/>ThabitiFellowElderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08590139703839397873noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28988815.post-41472045983176633522007-04-20T17:47:00.000-05:002007-04-20T17:47:00.000-05:00Good points, but you are unlikely to have a church...Good points, but you are unlikely to have a church that practices Biblical discipline if the Pastor's ability and success are judged by the number of people in the pew. In almost every case of discipline, people end up leaving (even when when someone who was under discipline repents). Numbers go down, and the Pastor's job is on the line.Shawn Abigailhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09810173103807948064noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28988815.post-13559339033823355962007-04-20T15:41:00.000-05:002007-04-20T15:41:00.000-05:00A lot of good stuff in the post. The only problem ...A lot of good stuff in the post. The only problem I have is all the stress put on membership. Why can't we leave people figure out for themself if they want to become members once they are saved. It seems like we rush them into membership before they even know what the other streams of Christianity have to say or how they go about following Jesus. I'm not talking about the new off the wall groups but true born again beleivers.<BR/><BR/>Jim Kahlertruthkeeperhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04026968262796466582noreply@blogger.com